I was recently interviewed at one of our hospital fundraising events by a local television news reporter. I was taught several years ago to always try to limit yourself to three key points during an interview, and I think I was able to do that this time. However, as I reflected on how well the interview went afterwards, I thought to myself, "Wow, I must have been nervous, because I kept interrupting the reporter and answering her questions before she was even finished asking them." I even started to worry if she had noticed that I was interrupting her.
Unfortunately, it is a well-known fact that men interrupt women all of the time! It happens so frequently, that there is a label for it - "manterrupting" (see the Nextions Yellow Paper Series article, "Mansplaining, Manterrupting & Bropropriating: Gender Bias and the Pervasive Interruption of Women" by lead researcher and President Dr. Arin N. Reeves for an excellent overview of this literature). And as it turns out, "manterrupting" has been around for a really long time. As early as 1985, Catherine Krupnick reported that, "Numerous studies have demonstrated that in mixed-sex conversations, women are interrupted far more frequently than men." More concerning, once women are interrupted, they are more likely to stay out of the discussion!
The American writer Rebecca Solnit wrote an essay in 2008 entitled, "Men Explain Things to Me" in which she introduced the term mansplaining into our lexicon. Solnit defined it as "a man interrupting a woman to explain to her something that she actually knows more about than he does." Of interest, but maybe not a surprise, Solnit was apparently in a discussion when a man first interrupted her and then began to talk about a very important book that had recently come out in her field. He quickly realized that Solnit was the author of the book!
Dr. Reeves observed 15 live meetings, 11 conference calls, and 3 panel discussions, which collectively amounted to 2,460 minutes of conversation. Each conversation had at least 5 people, of which at least 2 were women. All of the participants were leaders within organizations at the level of Partner/Managing Director or Vice President and above. She next interviewed 14 of the women and 13 of the men who had participated in these conversations. There were a total of 859 interruptions for an average of 29.6 interruptions per meeting/call/panel discussion. Of the 859 interruptions, 582 (67.8%) were by men and 277 (32.2%) were by women. More revealing, of the 582 interruptions by men, 418 of them (71.8%) were interruptions of women who were speaking! Surprisingly however, women were more likely to interrupt women speakers too (179 of the 277 interruptions involved women interrupting other women).
Whereas most of the interruptions by men were to state disagreement (usually) or agreement (at times), accelerate the conversation, or add a personal anecdote or perspective, the interruptions by women were usually to ask questions or for points to be repeated or clarified. The majority, by far, of interruptions of women by men were what is called intrusive interruptions, defined as "intentionally or unintentionally usurping the speaker's turn at talk with the intent of ceasing the speaker's ability to finish organically."
In the follow-up interviews, Dr. Evans found that most of the men were not aware of either interrupting anyone or having been interrupted. In contrast, the women were almost always conscious of the fact that they were being interrupted and expressed feelings of "disrespect", "feeling invisible", "being stuck" and unable to respond, and "frustrated". Unfortunately, women commonly feel this way because they are often subject to intrusive interruptions, as shown by Dr. Evans in her study and supported by a vast literature of similar studies (see, for example, a recent study on the frequency of interruptions during resident physician's morning report).
I was recently asked what am I personally doing to support our hospital's Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion initiatives. As I reflect on my recent interview, clearly I need to be more cognizant of the times that I interrupt someone and simply back-up and let the speaker finish. I've already started catching myself addressing female physicians as "Doctor" rather than using their first name (unless they request that I call them by their first name). And I can certainly continue to be a sponsor, an ally, and a mentor. Dr. Evans offer some even better advice and recommendations:
1. Create, use, and follow agendas for meetings ("An increase in structure leads to a decrease in interruptions.")
2. Remember what we all learned in kindergarten - Take turns! ("In meetings where the meeting leaders asked people to go around the table and give their perspectives, the clarity around who should be speaking was sharpened, and if someone interrupted, the interruptions were neutralized much faster...")
3. Call out interruptions, both before they happen and when they occur ("Remind people at the beginning of the meeting that interruptions prevent an effective exchange of ideas and make meetings longer than necessary" and "There is nothing that stops an interrupting man more than another man pointing out the interruptions."
It's clear we all need to do better, and as my recent experience shows, that starts with me.
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